Cao a tutti,leggendo in giro nel web ho trovto delle normative della windjet e una frase riportava:"nei raccordi ad alta velocità sarebbe gradito il landing after"ma cosa vuol dire?cos'è il landing after?
ciao
ciao
Allora c'ho preso!!!!!![]()
Non proprio. Il land after è una procedura che consente, sotto certe condizioni, di atterrare su una pista anche se il traffico precedente non ha ancora liberato.
In Italia è applicabile solamente (vado a memoria) a Fiumicino, e sulla 35R di Malpensa. Prendendo quest'ultima come esempio, l'AIP (AD2 LIMC 1-18) recita:
Procedura di "Land After" RWY 35R Malpensa
La procedura di Land after è operativa alle seguenti condizioni: quando la sequenza di traffico è di due successivi aeromobili in atterraggio, può essere consentito che il secondo aeromobile atterri prima che il primo aeromobile abbia liberato la pista in uso. Tale procedura si applica solo durante le ore del giorno purché:
- la pista sia asciutta e libera di qualsiasi tipo di precipitazione
- il secondo aeromobile sia stato informato e dichiari di essere in grado di vedere il primo aeromobile ininterrottamente fino a quando non abbia liberato la pista
Utilizzando la procedura di land after l'ATC non emetterà alcuna autorizzazione; fornirà invece al secondo aeromobile l'istruzione di atterrare dopo l'aereo che lo precede usando la seguente fraseologia:
"(nome compagnia) ATTERRARE DOPO (tipo aeromobile) IN ATTERRAGGIO SU RWY 35"
La responsabilità di garantire l'adeguata separazione tra i due aeromobili rimane del pilota del secondo aeromobile, compreso il rispetto delle separazioni previste per la turbolenza di scia.
I raccordi ad alta velocità diminuiscono la permanenza in pista degli a/m dopo l'atterraggio, per cui ci può stare che i vettori incoraggino l'uso del land after in quei casi. Se puoi citare per intero la normativa WindJet, magari il ragionamento diventa più chiaro.
Confermo quel che ha detto Nicola.
A MXP è applicabile solo sulla 35R perché sulla 35L non ci sono High speed exit taxyways.
Mettiamola così: mentre il traffico numero 2 esegue il land after, è probabile che il numero 1 faccia l'after landing checklist![]()
Mi rimane solo un dubbio: da come recita l'AIP ("il secondo aeromobile sia stato informato") sembra che la procedura sia di iniziativa del controllore. Ma mettiamo il caso di un pilota, che vede la sua separazione scadere fino a rischiare la riattaccata (è noto che i piloti spesso fanno gli uomini radar con il TCAS). Il pilota in questione può chiedere l'applicazione del land after?
Domanda: e' una cosa che ci siamo inventati in Italia, o una procedura ICAO?
Land After Procedure
A landing aircraft will not be permitted to cross the beginning of the runway on its final approach until a preceding departing aircraft is airborne.
A landing aircraft may be permitted to touch down before a preceding landing aircraft which has landed is clear of the runway provided that:-
a) the runway is long enough to allow safe separation between the two aircraft and there is no evidence to indicate that braking may be adversely affected
b) it is during daylight hours
c) the controller is satisfied that the landing aircraft will be able to see the preceding aircraft which has landed clearly and continuously, until it is clear of the runway, and
d) the pilot of the following aircraft is warned.
Responsibility for ensuring adequate separation rests with the pilot of the following aircraft.
Clear to Land After Procedure
When then runway is temporarily occupied by other traffic, landing clearance may be issued to an arriving aircraft provided that the Air Controller is satisfied that at the time the aircraft crosses the threshold, the following conditions will exist:-
a) Landing following landing
The preceding aircraft will be clear of the runway in use or at least 2500m from the threshold
b) Landing following departure
The departing aircraft will be airborne and at least 2000m from the threshold or if not airborne at least 2500m from the threshold
(These distances are reduced to 1500m in all cases when both aircraft concerned weigh less than 5700kg).
These special procedures are to be used by day only and under the following conditions:-
a) Reported met conditions are equal to or better than vis 6km and cloud ceiling 1000ft and the Air Controller is satisfied that the pilot of the next arriving aircraft will be able to continously observe the relevant traffic
b) When both aircraft are being operated normally (pilots responsible for notifying ATC if otherwise)
c) When the runway is dry and the braking action is good
d) When the Air Controller is able to assess separations either visually or by means of ATM (Aerodrome Traffic Monitor) information
RTF phraseology when runway temporarily occupied. "BAW123 after the landing/departing (type) cleared to land 27L".
The "Cleared to Land After" procedure may not be used when both aircraft are still in the air. (Impossible to judge whether preceding will be 2500m down the runway or clear when next arriving aircraft crosses the threshold). The CLA procedure is a landing clearance with the ATCO taking responsibility for separation. The LA procedure is not a landing clearance - the pilot is responsible for judging separation. CLA may be used after departing traffic - LA may not. Weather criteria are built into the use of CLA - none for LA.
The "land after" procedure can be used at all aerodromes. The "cleared to land after" procedure is only used at EGLL, EGKK, EGSS and EGCC
Domanda: e' una cosa che ci siamo inventati in Italia, o una procedura ICAO?
Citazione:
Originalmente inviato da Tiennetti Visualizza messaggio
Domanda: e' una cosa che ci siamo inventati in Italia, o una procedura ICAO?
trovato in un altro forum e molto chiaro...
Citazione:
Land After Procedure
A landing aircraft will not be permitted to cross the beginning of the runway on its final approach until a preceding departing aircraft is airborne.
A landing aircraft may be permitted to touch down before a preceding landing aircraft which has landed is clear of the runway provided that:-
a) the runway is long enough to allow safe separation between the two aircraft and there is no evidence to indicate that braking may be adversely affected
b) it is during daylight hours
c) the controller is satisfied that the landing aircraft will be able to see the preceding aircraft which has landed clearly and continuously, until it is clear of the runway, and
d) the pilot of the following aircraft is warned.
Responsibility for ensuring adequate separation rests with the pilot of the following aircraft.
Clear to Land After Procedure
When then runway is temporarily occupied by other traffic, landing clearance may be issued to an arriving aircraft provided that the Air Controller is satisfied that at the time the aircraft crosses the threshold, the following conditions will exist:-
a) Landing following landing
The preceding aircraft will be clear of the runway in use or at least 2500m from the threshold
b) Landing following departure
The departing aircraft will be airborne and at least 2000m from the threshold or if not airborne at least 2500m from the threshold
(These distances are reduced to 1500m in all cases when both aircraft concerned weigh less than 5700kg).
These special procedures are to be used by day only and under the following conditions:-
a) Reported met conditions are equal to or better than vis 6km and cloud ceiling 1000ft and the Air Controller is satisfied that the pilot of the next arriving aircraft will be able to continously observe the relevant traffic
b) When both aircraft are being operated normally (pilots responsible for notifying ATC if otherwise)
c) When the runway is dry and the braking action is good
d) When the Air Controller is able to assess separations either visually or by means of ATM (Aerodrome Traffic Monitor) information
RTF phraseology when runway temporarily occupied. "BAW123 after the landing/departing (type) cleared to land 27L".
The "Cleared to Land After" procedure may not be used when both aircraft are still in the air. (Impossible to judge whether preceding will be 2500m down the runway or clear when next arriving aircraft crosses the threshold). The CLA procedure is a landing clearance with the ATCO taking responsibility for separation. The LA procedure is not a landing clearance - the pilot is responsible for judging separation. CLA may be used after departing traffic - LA may not. Weather criteria are built into the use of CLA - none for LA.
The "land after" procedure can be used at all aerodromes. The "cleared to land after" procedure is only used at EGLL, EGKK, EGSS and EGCC
In molti posti del mondo è lo standard...addirittura negli USA non lo dicono manco in frequenza, è sottointeso!
Grazie della informazione, adesso, oltre a sapere come operano, so anche perchè![]()